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Old 16th March 2019, 10:27   #1 (permalink)
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desperate for information Turkish Property Valuation

Hi everyone

I am new to the forum although I have been reading your posts for a while now. We are in the process of buying a house in the outskirts of Antalya with the help of a mortgage from the Turkish bank arranged through a broker in UK. In the middle of the negotiations over the price it has come to our attention that the value of the house stated on the tapu is 1/3 of the asking price as the seller is a developer and the house is new and he does not want to pay too much tax on it.
The estate agents are telling us that we have to pay the tax at 3%, which was not a lot but the other day they increased the fake price by almost doubling it so that means that we have to pay a higher tax now.
The higher tax we don't mind but I am extremely confused on these accounts:
1) Why did the fake price suddenly go up?
2) Is it normal for the buyer to pay this tax as it seems to be related to the profit that the seller is making?
3) As majority of the money is being financed through the mortgage how will the bank react to this? As the seller seems to want his money in cash?
4) Is it not a problem for later on that a much lower value is placed on the tapu?

As you can imagine we are going out of our minds asking these questions and not getting satisfactory answers.
We have spoken to an English speaking lawyer and he is charging 500 Euros to help us with the purchase. Is this OK?
And one last question is as the house is being bought with a mortgage and we don't plan to sell it but just in case if we have to sell it in future, is it possible to sell a property with a mortgage in Turkey? I am asking this as many people seem to prefer cash buyers.

I would be really grateful if you could advise me please.
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Old 16th March 2019, 12:10   #2 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

The value written on the TAPU were 'fiddle values' so when built the buyer and the builder paid less tax, so basically they do not mean a great deal.
Tax will be paid as you say at 3% of the value the council/Tapu office deem it is worth and not necessarily either what is written on the Tapu or what you pay.
SO if paying a lot more than what the office say it's worth 'do not' go shouting about how much you are paying, or you end up paying more tax and it may also effect your annual Council Tax bill. (forever)

But no-doubt someone with far greater knowledge will intervene with more or more accurate information.
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Old 16th March 2019, 14:22   #3 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

Welcome to TLF.

The price on the tapu will have increased because there is a mortgage, and the lender will want the true debt registered to cover their risk.Their lawyers will not approve the purchase without a true value to cover their risk. Would you?
Higher price = higher tax to pay. We had the same experience when selling a flat some years ago.

It's also better for you if you sell later, as there is a record of the true price for any possible capital gains tax liability. You should also get a receipt from the vendor for the full price, get it witnessed and stamped by either the lawyer and/or estate agent's business stamp. Keep all your banking documentation too.

The land/transaction tax is 4% of the disclosed price paid to the Belediye. Normally the Belediye (council) register their council tax banding value rather than the sale price. I'm not sure if there is a discount currently for new builds.

It's normal for buyer and seller to split the 4%land tax equally between them, so stand your ground.

Be aware that both buyer and seller also pay 3% commission to the agent. This is not the same as the land tax.


500€ seems rather steep. Was the practice recommended to you by anyone? Most purchases are done in a day. You do not have the same protection as in UK, no guarantees on new builds, no searches, etc. It's all your responsibility.

Make sure that the deeds are clean and there are no undisclosed loans or charges registered against the land/property before you complete the purchase. The lawyer should get a certificate from the 'Emlak vergisi' department in the Belediye.
They should also ensure that the tapu has the correct (red) border and confirms the full planning and habitation certification.

If you have ANY doubts or worries keep asking and dont sign anything until you are happy.

There is lots of experience and advice on the forum.
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Old 16th March 2019, 15:27   #4 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

I would try a cheeky complaint to the vendor and try to get them to pay your increased tax costs. It may work, depending on how desperate they are for the sale to go though.
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Old 16th March 2019, 23:24   #5 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

This may also to do with the law that came into effect on 4th March 2019, where undervaluing is now totally illegal and an independent valuer has to state the official value of the property which will be recorded at the Tapu and Belediye offices.
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Old 17th March 2019, 08:10   #6 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

Thank you so much everyone for your help and advice.
So from what I understand you are saying that it doesn't matter too much what the value is on the tapu as this is the normal practice. what about the fact that:

The seller is making us pay the full 3% for the tax and also as we are trying to buy this with a mortgage, surely the bank will put the right price on the documents and then the seller will be liable to pay much higher capital gains tax and from what we've understood they are also trying to shift that onto us.

Also can anyone please advise me if it's possible to sell a house with a mortgage in case in the future we are forced to sell?

can anyone recommend any lawyers as I also think this one that we are going to use is too expensive.

Very finally if and when we have managed to get this house, we have a 14 year old son and can anyone recommend any good schools please? I know of ICCA but are there any other ones?

Thank you so so much.

Last edited by Sabrina T; 17th March 2019 at 08:26..
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Old 17th March 2019, 10:53   #7 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabrina T View Post
Thank you so much everyone for your help and advice.
So from what I understand you are saying that it doesn't matter too much what the value is on the tapu as this is the normal practice. what about the fact that:

The seller is making us pay the full 3% for the tax and also as we are trying to buy this with a mortgage, surely the bank will put the right price on the documents and then the seller will be liable to pay much higher capital gains tax and from what we've understood they are also trying to shift that onto us.

Also can anyone please advise me if it's possible to sell a house with a mortgage in case in the future we are forced to sell?

can anyone recommend any lawyers as I also think this one that we are going to use is too expensive.

Very finally if and when we have managed to get this house, we have a 14 year old son and can anyone recommend any good schools please? I know of ICCA but are there any other ones?

Thank you so so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by REDDERS View Post
This may also to do with the law that came into effect on 4th March 2019, where undervaluing is now totally illegal and an independent valuer has to state the official value of the property which will be recorded at the Tapu and Belediye offices.
I think you may have missed this post as it does matter what value is on the tapu
As to the sellers taxes that their problem and the estate agent shouldn't be trying to pass on the sellers tax liabilities to you

Out of interest is the estate agent one that you decided to deal with or is it an estate agent that was suggested to you by the property developer
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Old 17th March 2019, 11:29   #8 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

Hi

I don't think I misunderstood as some were saying it does matter and others were saying it is just a "fiddle" price.
but anyway the agents I found through Sahibinden as I also found this house through the same website.

Thank you again for all your help and please keep the advice coming.
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Old 17th March 2019, 11:51   #9 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

It is now illegal to declare wrong values as Redders says above, also your future sanity and worry is not worth it. The seller saving money is not your problem, nor is the the fact they want to do things their way.

If they want to do an iffy deal then walk away!
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Old 17th March 2019, 12:04   #10 (permalink)
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Re: desperate for information

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabrina T View Post
Hi

I don't think I misunderstood as some were saying it does matter and others were saying it is just a "fiddle" price.
but anyway the agents I found through Sahibinden as I also found this house through the same website.

Thank you again for all your help and please keep the advice coming.
The fiddle price mention in some posts relate to a practice that happen 10 years ago and therefore not relevant to anyone buying property today

Here is some info on Capital gains tax for property in Turkey
https://www.propertyturkey.com/buyer...rkish-property

Last edited by esb1841; 17th March 2019 at 12:16.. Reason: additional info
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