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Old 23rd February 2012, 18:40   #61 (permalink)
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Re: Fetih-1453

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Originally Posted by AntalyaIstanbul View Post
No, It must not hurt we don't have racism is based on blood unlike the western societies and we agree non Turks but ''Sinan was Armenian'' claim belongs to NAZI propaganda against Turks and Turks agree most of the padishah mothers are foreigner and most of them mixed. Ottoman was a multicultural state.


Different things and different doctrine because Turkiye is not the only heir of the Ottoman Empire, all Ottoman lands heir of the Ottoman empire for citizenship and rights.
well that must mean the Nazis were around hundreds of years before we heard about them..as all the information about Sinan pre dates the Nazis..
and many of the countries that the Ottomans occupied were glad when they were kicked out.
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Old 23rd February 2012, 18:46   #62 (permalink)
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Re: Fetih-1453

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Originally Posted by shirleyanntr View Post
it must hurt to think that sinan was not Turkish
No one is Turkish by this definition because at this period there was no such thing as 'Turkish', just the Muslim, Christian and Jewish millets. Sinan was an Ottoman. You cannot use the barometer of today's political terms to judge whether Sinan was a Turk or not because there was no such thing as a Turkish nation state.

A Turk is not someone who descended from Central Asia but broadly speaking a Turk is someone who belongs to the Turkic linguistic group and has a blood line of some sort to that group.

There was a lot of conversion between Christian and Muslim religions in the Ottoman period, which is why I find the term 'Greek' to describe the 'Rum' to be a problematic term. They were not Greek, they were Anatolian Christians, many of whom converted from Islam. They didn't fall from the sky.

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now how of the Ottoman Empire have passports and rights in Turkey?
Turkey isn't the Ottoman Empire, nor is it a successor state. Read up on the treaties of the 1920s and 1930s. You would be well advised to read Medeni Bilgi by Ayşe Afet İnan (actually written by Atatürk himself), in her book she details that Christians, Jews, etc are part of the Turkish nation but that those 'dış Türkler' cannot be part of the Turkish nation except through citizenship. Hence, the existence of Turkic groups in the Balkans who, because they are not citizens of Turkey, have no relationship to the Turkish nation state.
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Old 23rd February 2012, 21:22   #63 (permalink)
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Re: Fetih-1453

thank you supra..and of course i realise that the 'Turkish nation' was not in existence at the time we are talking about...i just dont like anybody telling me i dont anything about the Ottoman or Turkish history as was said in an earlier post..it ruffled my feathers hah.
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Old 24th February 2012, 03:07   #64 (permalink)
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Re: Fetih-1453

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Originally Posted by Carolyn View Post
I was very surprised when I read how cosmopolitan Istanbul was under the Ottomans with so many different nationalities and religions living and working in the city.

I understand that the Janissaries too were recruited from amongst Christian converts.

There is also a lot of architectural and religious heritage that had survived and was preserved when I imagine many cultures and nations would have razed it to the ground.
You will very surprised to when you learn complete. Very unreal things described in west about harem, Ottoman sultans and Ottoman ethnics tragically.

Istanbul was not belongs to the any culture and Christians was not a minority in Anatolia and Istanbul in Ottoman time. The Greeks took part in Ottoman palaces more than the Turks


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Originally Posted by shirleyanntr View Post
well that must mean the Nazis were around hundreds of years before we heard about them..as all the information about Sinan pre dates the Nazis..
and many of the countries that the Ottomans occupied were glad when they were kicked out.

The claim is not new but NAZI's used propaganda against Turkiye for NAZI nationalism.


Some countries glad for example Saudi Arabia... Muslims (there is not Turk or nationality definition in Ottoman), Christians and Jews lived in peace and brotherhood in Ottoman time before the briths provoked the ethnics and religious groups against the Ottoman for divide and conquered to ''sick man'' Ottoman.

Today you see the churches in Turkiye, Ottoman and republic of Turkiye never demolished any religions temple and in fact Turkish government protecting and restoring Armenian and Greek churches but you can't see the Ottoman mosques, mescids and buildings in Armenia and Greece.
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Old 13th September 2018, 17:03   #65 (permalink)
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Re: Fetih-1453

Go watch folks and see what you think.


I thought it was okay; probably miles away from what really happened.
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