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Old 10th July 2011, 09:35   #21 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

thanks Nomad..the Ottoman language is very interesting..i would love to know more about it...and the history behind the changes we see today...you could make a thread about this im sure many people will be interested .
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Old 10th July 2011, 10:06   #22 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shirleyanntr View Post
thanks Nomad..the Ottoman language is very interesting..i would love to know more about it...and the history behind the changes we see today...you could make a thread about this im sure many people will be interested .
No, I am not a linguist. But, Ottomanish is simple. Take Arabic or Persian word and use it in Turkish way by adding suffix, etc. For example, kitap/book is an Arabic word. When you say "Kitapçı"/book seller, it becomes Ottomanish.
Another one. Sıhhat, health, is an Arabic origin word. When you say Sıhhatli, Healthy, it becomes Ottomanish. Beyaz, Mavi are Persian words for Ak (White) and Gök (blue). When you say Beyazımsı (whiteish), Mavimsi (blueish), etc these words become Ottomanish. So simple. These are simple words. In law books, there are many Arabic words that are not understood by new Turkey generations anymore. But, there is a new Turkey-ish language now. For ex., televizyoncu, television seller or repairer.
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Old 10th July 2011, 10:13   #23 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

I need to mention why I am talking about original Turkish and Ottomanish.
For example, beyaz = white can be understood by Azeri people too as they are close to Persia/Iran, but, in Turkmenistan or in other Turkic places, people may not understand your Turkish when you say Beyaz. In such places, instead of beyaz, you need to say Ak, which is preferred word in rural Anatolia too.
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Old 10th July 2011, 10:13   #24 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

i was recently helping a friend with some legal problems and the lawyer we fıound for him hasnt much English...my turkish is ok..not perfect..but when i was reading the renewed contract i spotted a word i hadnt seen before..Rücu....and asked the lawyer what it meant..(its was revoke) he then went on to explain to me about old Ottoman words and how when they do Law in Turkey they must learn old Ottoman language...(i suppose like a Doctor must learn Latin) as many legal terms are in Ottomanish.

İ thought that when the language laws were introduced by Atatürk that they were trying to phase out the Arabic and Persian words...?
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Old 10th July 2011, 10:28   #25 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

I too have been having lots of troubles. I often check dictionaries. For ex., I didn't understand "rücu" now, but, I know it is a word frequently used in legal law documents. Istanbul, cosmopolitic cultural center of Ottomans, has still been dictating Ottomanish, you know why, there are old people who still make their breads by being elites who speak Ottomanish. In last century of Ottomans, French words too entered the life. Then, Turkish became German-ish, England-ish, American-ish too. In cities, when I use the word "Ak", white, instead of Beyaz, they see me as rude, rough person. But, there are advantages of using original Turkish sometimes. You can communicate with broader Turkic community when you use original, old Turkic words. For ex., Ak = white is used everywhere in Turkic communities from Azerbaijan to Uigurs in China to Tatars in East Europe. But, beyaz is used only in Turkey and in Azerbaijani part of Iran as it is a Persian word.
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Old 10th July 2011, 10:33   #26 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

i can see the influence of words for new technologies creeping into Turkish..and also in football ..foul freekick goal etc
televizyon makina and so ..although these derivations of english(and originally ancient Greek) are coming into most languages nowadays..eventually we may all be able to undersand each other and speak a similar language.
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Old 10th July 2011, 10:56   #27 (permalink)
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Re: essential words 1.

True, communities are borrowing many words from each others. In Turkey Turkish today, after Selcuk empire which was more with Persians, we have lots of Persian words in Turkey Turkish. After Ottomans, we have had many Arabic words too. In their last century, we even have many French words. Tesekkur was a word used by Ottoman elites and spreaded to other cities too. Mersi was a word often being used by elite community in Istanbul as well as by Ankara elites. You still hear on TVs singers, artists say Mersi.

To those who will be interested in learning Turkish, I don't advice them to memorize words. Just learn structure, agglunative character of Turkish as it is a part of Altaic family, etc it is enough. If you take an English word, say "show", if you use it "showcu", you started to speak Turkey Turkish, actually, Ankara Turkish now. It was "temaşa-cı" before Turkey republic.

But, learning old Turkic words is useful as they can be understood by Turkic communities outside of Turkey too. I gave an example about Ak, white, above which can be understood by any Turkic community in the world while beyaz can not be understood everywhere.

Here is another interesting word which you may find very interesting. Dam.. (You know its version in Latin, Greek, Euro languages too - Dom. as in Kingdom for ex.) Dam is old Turkic word for any type of house with a ceiling, broader word than "ev", house. Damlamak = to drop, comes from this root, Dam. Nobody knows if this word is borrowed from Turkic to Indo-Euro or from Indo-Euro to Turkic. Europeans claim it is originally Euro-language word. But, I claim otherwise as it is more meaningful in Turkic. However, it may also show that Turks might be in Anatolia several tousands of years too. Anyway, learning such old Turkic words may help you to learn old Turkish/Turkic language better so that you won't be surprised when you hear Dam word everywhere which is used for from jail to garage to ceiling, etc.

However, for beginners, I suggest not to focus themselves to learn words as even Turks are confused. Learning structure, its agglutinativeness, suffixes, etc will be enough to be able to communicate with Turkey people.

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